Duel Wield - Guild Wars Forums

Worldx · Mar 27, 2005, 05:14 AM // 05:14

can any melee class duel wield weapons?

worthless · Mar 27, 2005, 05:17 AM // 05:17

no duel wielding

Worldx · Mar 27, 2005, 05:17 AM // 05:17

damn :'(
any clues to a chance in a update / expansion

Weezer_Blue · Mar 27, 2005, 05:22 AM // 05:22

nope. no dual (not duel as in "i challenge you to a duel!") wielding weapons in GW. perhaps in a later expansion. but it would be unbalanced for all of the current classes.

Mss Drizzt · Mar 27, 2005, 05:53 AM // 05:53

Balance Balance Balance. We warriors have 2 hands so we should carry 2 swords.

Scimitars would be nice.

ThePaper · Mar 27, 2005, 05:58 AM // 05:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by Weezer_Blue

nope. no dual (not duel as in "i challenge you to a duel!") wielding weapons in GW. perhaps in a later expansion. but it would be unbalanced for all of the current classes.

I have to disagree there. Dual weilding would be balanced as letting you do more damage with less defense. sheilds add def, focuses add energy, and a second weapon adds damage. I do think that it should bring less damage per weapon, or maybe less accuracy, or only certain weapons can be in the second hand. Also I don't think it should be added in this chapter, since it would only push the game release back even farther, but it would be a good add for maybe an assasin-like class, or pirates, berserkers, etc. though many of those clases are inside the warrior class...

BlackArrow · Mar 27, 2005, 06:06 AM // 06:06

Dual wielding would be cool, if it could be balanced.

ThePaper, imagine Dual wielding with IW. That's like using IW + 100 Blades every second. That and the adrenaline gain rate would double for sword warriors. Those are really my only balancing concerns though. Hammers already lose defense for damage.

ThePaper · Mar 27, 2005, 06:15 AM // 06:15

Yes i agree that it might be hard to balance dual weild for the existing classes, but it would be a great add for new classes. Also it could be made so that skills wont put the added weapon into the calculations, so you would only use the skill with your main weapon, and the other weap would just add damage for regular attacks, or something like that.

Kha · Mar 27, 2005, 06:24 AM // 06:24

Maybe a new profession will have Dual Wielding as an attribute, which would be cool. The higher the attribute, the more damage you do with each weapon. This would make sense since you have an attribute to learn swords, and an attribute to learn axes, etc. Maybe Dual Wielding will introduce a new weapon, like a kind of dagger/katana, a smaller, lighter sword. Would be cool

Maugrim · Mar 27, 2005, 06:54 AM // 06:54

If dual wielding were to be added, I think it would go something like this...

+50-75% increased attack rate
80-90% max damage of regular swords
1/2 adrenaline gain on hit

Another thing would be that the 2nd sword could act as a shield, proviving armor...so that also would throw off balance. Same with Live Vicariously, energy drain/life drain on hit swords, Conjure X spells, Strength in Honor, Flurry and Frenzy would all make this unbalanced.

I think I would vote no for dual wielding because it would create too many problems, but if they found a way to make things balanced, I'd say go for it. I would really like dual wielding but not the problems that could come with it.

(edit) Kha could be on to something...Making a whole different attribute for Dual Wielding with the Warrior so he'd have to invest points into Dual Wielding AND Swordsmanship. That attribute could affect a certain penalty to your offhand weapon maybe? Like at level 0, it would do 5% regular damage? So then it could only be raised to a maximum of 60% of the swords regular damage. Then if you decided to put all the runes in and headpiece for 16, you'd have 80% of the swords maximum damage. And then you would factor in the Swordsmanship level to figure out how much damage you actually do. At 12 Swordsmanship, you would deal 100% damage with your primary weapon and with 12 in Dual your secondary weapon would deal the full 60% damage.

Mss Drizzt · Mar 27, 2005, 06:59 AM // 06:59

Yes your right but then true warriors that use 2 swords have to be good because the swords are their sheild and wepon.

And please if I hear Balance one more time I'm going to puke.

Maugrim · Mar 27, 2005, 07:43 AM // 07:43

Balance

If they added a Rogue class, the attributes could be like this:

*Primary Only* Stealth or Mind Evasion/Concentration: some kind of evasion for DoTs/Hexes? No passive bonuses, it would just be skills that make opponent's hex spells less effective.
Ranged Attack: more proficient when using- Throwing Daggers, Shuriken, Darts
Dual Wield: More proficient while using- Short Swordx2, Long Sword+Short Sword, Scimitarx2, Daggerx2 (melee) or any combo of 2 weapons.
Charisma (ok, I stepped into Bards a little): Songs/Shouts and stuff that buff/debuff. Songs could be like spells, taking time to cast, but they would act as a shout type skill.

Not the most rounded/balanced

class, and would definately need changes but I'm sure A.net could make Dual Wielding work somehow.

Greentongue · Mar 27, 2005, 02:38 PM // 14:38

I agree that a new Profession would be the best way to add Duel Wield.
Limiting it to specific weapons adds control to its use.
Two daggers or "blades" that extend bare hand fighting would work well.
The attack speed of swords/axes is reasonable, considering that you have to close range to attack.

This Profession could also be given the ability to throw these weapons. (A magical attack that was a cross between Stone Daggers and Barrage.)

Also the "weaving" of duel weapons could allow a projectile defense like Deflect Arrows or Whirling Defense.

Kiwi · Mar 27, 2005, 03:10 PM // 15:10

The only way to make it balanced would be to have a 25% cut in damage and speed for each weapon.

Kha · Mar 27, 2005, 04:41 PM // 16:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kiwi

The only way to make it balanced would be to have a 25% cut in damage and speed for each weapon.

That's if they used the current weapons for dual wielding. If they made a whole new kind of weapon and put dual wielding as an attribute, there would be no need to make that kind of change because they would already be designed for balance. It seems a little too powerful if they would allow for the current weapons to be dual wieldable depending on how they will make it work.

I like the idea of creating a new profession (rogue/assassin/ninja) with a Dual Wield attribute rather than give it to the already established classes (warrior and possibly ranger). That way, say you have a W/A (Warrior/Assassin) and have points in both Axe Mastery and Dual Wielding. You would be able to dual wield axes. Maybe Dual Wielding skills will be for you to use your secondary weapon or using both weapons at one time, while in this case Axe Mastery skills would work for only your primary weapon.

And I like Maugrim's idea of a Rogue class (minus the Charisma.)

ThePaper · Mar 27, 2005, 05:08 PM // 17:08

OK as for the rouge class, I think it should be like this (borrowing some from maugrim)

Primary Attribute is Stealth- Comes with the ability Stealth, with each added attribute making it harder to be spotted.

Assassination- Gives some backstab abilities, maybe poison that hinders them and such, requires use of a dagger.

Dual Wield- Lets you use a dagger/sword in off hand, and each point adds effectiveness of it. (passive 80%-90% decrease without it) And gives a few skills for use with the 2 weapons. Also using a sword lets you do more damage, and a dagger lets you use assassination moves.

Dirty Fighting- Has no passive bonus, but adds to skills like Shuriken/Throw daggers, a Throw dirt type skill, evasion (passive but uses a skill slot), etc...

Also you would probably add a few skills to other classes that detect the assassin when he is stealthed, so it won't become too unbalanced. I think this would work well for a assassin type, only thing hard will be the stealth, making it fair and keeping it balanced.

Kha · Mar 27, 2005, 05:19 PM // 17:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by ThePaper

I think this would work well for a assassin type, only thing hard will be the stealth, making it fair and keeping it balanced.

The fact that they never implemented Stealth when it was a Ranger attribute might be a sign that they either don't plan on ever using it, or are coming up with a different look for it so it fits with GW's balance theme.

Maugrim · Mar 27, 2005, 05:22 PM // 17:22

Assassination!!! Thats what I was thinking of but I just couldn't name it! Could be full of backstabs and poison coated weaponry (like Poison Arrow but for melee). Only reason I said Charisma as a skill line is because I couldn't name this one lol.

And I like your idea for "dirty fighting". The assassin could be our first unarmed melee fighter with that. Add some kicks punches and some ninjitsu moves to take enemies to the ground.

Mar 27, 2005, 05:14 AM // 05:14	#1
Worldx Ascalonian Squire Join Date: Mar 2005	Duel Wield can any melee class duel wield weapons?

Mar 27, 2005, 05:22 AM // 05:22	#4
Weezer_Blue Elite Guru Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Just a Box in a Cage Guild: Hurry Up The Cakes [Oven]	nope. no dual (not duel as in "i challenge you to a duel!") wielding weapons in GW. perhaps in a later expansion. but it would be unbalanced for all of the current classes. __________________

Mar 27, 2005, 06:24 AM // 06:24	#9
Kha Sins FTW! Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: USA Guild: Angel Sharks [AS]	Maybe a new profession will have Dual Wielding as an attribute, which would be cool. The higher the attribute, the more damage you do with each weapon. This would make sense since you have an attribute to learn swords, and an attribute to learn axes, etc. Maybe Dual Wielding will introduce a new weapon, like a kind of dagger/katana, a smaller, lighter sword. Would be cool __________________

Mar 27, 2005, 06:54 AM // 06:54	#10
Maugrim Ascalonian Squire Join Date: Mar 2005	If dual wielding were to be added, I think it would go something like this... +50-75% increased attack rate 80-90% max damage of regular swords 1/2 adrenaline gain on hit Another thing would be that the 2nd sword could act as a shield, proviving armor...so that also would throw off balance. Same with Live Vicariously, energy drain/life drain on hit swords, Conjure X spells, Strength in Honor, Flurry and Frenzy would all make this unbalanced. I think I would vote no for dual wielding because it would create too many problems, but if they found a way to make things balanced, I'd say go for it. I would really like dual wielding but not the problems that could come with it. (edit) Kha could be on to something...Making a whole different attribute for Dual Wielding with the Warrior so he'd have to invest points into Dual Wielding AND Swordsmanship. That attribute could affect a certain penalty to your offhand weapon maybe? Like at level 0, it would do 5% regular damage? So then it could only be raised to a maximum of 60% of the swords regular damage. Then if you decided to put all the runes in and headpiece for 16, you'd have 80% of the swords maximum damage. And then you would factor in the Swordsmanship level to figure out how much damage you actually do. At 12 Swordsmanship, you would deal 100% damage with your primary weapon and with 12 in Dual your secondary weapon would deal the full 60% damage. Last edited by Maugrim; Mar 27, 2005 at 07:05 AM // 07:05..

Mar 27, 2005, 07:43 AM // 07:43	#12
Maugrim Ascalonian Squire Join Date: Mar 2005	Balance If they added a Rogue class, the attributes could be like this: Primary Only Stealth or Mind Evasion/Concentration: some kind of evasion for DoTs/Hexes? No passive bonuses, it would just be skills that make opponent's hex spells less effective. Ranged Attack: more proficient when using- Throwing Daggers, Shuriken, Darts Dual Wield: More proficient while using- Short Swordx2, Long Sword+Short Sword, Scimitarx2, Daggerx2 (melee) or any combo of 2 weapons. Charisma (ok, I stepped into Bards a little): Songs/Shouts and stuff that buff/debuff. Songs could be like spells, taking time to cast, but they would act as a shout type skill. Not the most rounded/balanced class, and would definately need changes but I'm sure A.net could make Dual Wielding work somehow. Last edited by Maugrim; Mar 27, 2005 at 07:45 AM // 07:45.. Reason: sp, grammer

Mar 27, 2005, 05:17 AM // 05:17	#2
worthless Lion's Arch Merchant Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: TX	no duel wielding

Mar 27, 2005, 05:53 AM // 05:53	#5
Mss Drizzt Lion's Arch Merchant Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: communist state of NJ	Balance Balance Balance. We warriors have 2 hands so we should carry 2 swords. Scimitars would be nice.

Mar 27, 2005, 06:06 AM // 06:06	#7
BlackArrow Banned Join Date: Feb 2005	Dual wielding would be cool, if it could be balanced. ThePaper, imagine Dual wielding with IW. That's like using IW + 100 Blades every second. That and the adrenaline gain rate would double for sword warriors. Those are really my only balancing concerns though. Hammers already lose defense for damage.

Mar 27, 2005, 06:15 AM // 06:15	#8
ThePaper Banned Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: I live in an atom bomb in Japan	Yes i agree that it might be hard to balance dual weild for the existing classes, but it would be a great add for new classes. Also it could be made so that skills wont put the added weapon into the calculations, so you would only use the skill with your main weapon, and the other weap would just add damage for regular attacks, or something like that.

Mar 27, 2005, 06:59 AM // 06:59	#11
Mss Drizzt Lion's Arch Merchant Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: communist state of NJ	Yes your right but then true warriors that use 2 swords have to be good because the swords are their sheild and wepon. And please if I hear Balance one more time I'm going to puke.

Mar 27, 2005, 02:38 PM // 14:38	#13
Greentongue Frost Gate Guardian Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Orlando, FL	I agree that a new Profession would be the best way to add Duel Wield. Limiting it to specific weapons adds control to its use. Two daggers or "blades" that extend bare hand fighting would work well. The attack speed of swords/axes is reasonable, considering that you have to close range to attack. This Profession could also be given the ability to throw these weapons. (A magical attack that was a cross between Stone Daggers and Barrage.) Also the "weaving" of duel weapons could allow a projectile defense like Deflect Arrows or Whirling Defense.

Mar 27, 2005, 03:10 PM // 15:10	#14
Kiwi Krytan Explorer Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: The Holy Land of Kiwis!	The only way to make it balanced would be to have a 25% cut in damage and speed for each weapon.

Mar 27, 2005, 05:08 PM // 17:08	#16
ThePaper Banned Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: I live in an atom bomb in Japan	OK as for the rouge class, I think it should be like this (borrowing some from maugrim) Primary Attribute is Stealth- Comes with the ability Stealth, with each added attribute making it harder to be spotted. Assassination- Gives some backstab abilities, maybe poison that hinders them and such, requires use of a dagger. Dual Wield- Lets you use a dagger/sword in off hand, and each point adds effectiveness of it. (passive 80%-90% decrease without it) And gives a few skills for use with the 2 weapons. Also using a sword lets you do more damage, and a dagger lets you use assassination moves. Dirty Fighting- Has no passive bonus, but adds to skills like Shuriken/Throw daggers, a Throw dirt type skill, evasion (passive but uses a skill slot), etc... Also you would probably add a few skills to other classes that detect the assassin when he is stealthed, so it won't become too unbalanced. I think this would work well for a assassin type, only thing hard will be the stealth, making it fair and keeping it balanced. Last edited by ThePaper; Mar 27, 2005 at 05:11 PM // 17:11.. Reason: spelling

Mar 27, 2005, 05:22 PM // 17:22	#18
Maugrim Ascalonian Squire Join Date: Mar 2005	Assassination!!! Thats what I was thinking of but I just couldn't name it! Could be full of backstabs and poison coated weaponry (like Poison Arrow but for melee). Only reason I said Charisma as a skill line is because I couldn't name this one lol. And I like your idea for "dirty fighting". The assassin could be our first unarmed melee fighter with that. Add some kicks punches and some ninjitsu moves to take enemies to the ground.